User talk:Crystalbeastdeck09/Nationalism
I don't really get the point. So Oceana is very nationalistic, who cares? And why should there be lot's of French people packed together in a new hamlet? We already have one filled with Russians, while there appears to be no Chinatown, Koreatown or Lill' Italy in Noble City. Of course, you are free to invent these things for yourself, expand articles and create new stuff. If this kind of freedom does not excist and we all hang on to all that has already been written, we cannot use our imagination anymore and flush our creativity down the gutter... Do as you like, write what you like, I'm fine with it. I don't see the need for it, but that's an entirely different discussion. Do as you please - hopefully in cooperation and conversation with others, in a more-or-less democratic approach. And good luck! The Master's Voice 17:36, May 27, 2011 (UTC) :Well, Canada is a lot bigger than Lovia of course :P --OuWTBsjrief-mich 06:56, May 28, 2011 (UTC) ::Which kinda the point where a country with 20,000 people, and 1/4 of them are going one way, i'm not saying it's a bad thing but it sounds like serbian-bosian europe, which might lead to a war. Boy i wonder what two major wars started beacuse of a Nationalistic view? Marcus/Michael Villanova 11:47, May 28, 2011 (UTC) :::Nationalism didn't lead to WWI(I), it was just a means to justify those wars. The real causes were power on the international scene, territorial expansion (including colonies for WWI) and economic power. Nationalism in itself is harmless, it all depends on what you are trying to reach by appealing to the feeling of national unity. Can't stress this enough. 12:53, May 28, 2011 (UTC) :It lead to the murder of Archduke Ferdanand. So it kinda lead to a domino effect. Marcus/Michael Villanova 13:26, May 28, 2011 (UTC) ::The murder was only the direct motive (I don't quite know how to translate the Dutch 'aanleiding') for the war, not its cause. 13:31, May 28, 2011 (UTC) :::But the slovak and serb national movements were also apart of this no? Marcus/Michael Villanova 13:35, May 28, 2011 (UTC) ::::Sure, but do you honestly believe all of Europe made war over some guy getting killed by a terrorist? The Russian Empire wanted to expand into the Balkan, Austria-Hungary wanted to restore its control in the Balken (as did the Ottomans), the Germans wanted to secure their status of 'leader of the continent', the UK wanted to prevent that any party would become too strong, France wanted payback for what the Germans did in 1870, etc. 13:37, May 28, 2011 (UTC) :::::Yuri is totally right. Europe at the time was a tank of political explosives, the assassination was just the match thrown in. It could have been a different match; the same war would have happened. --Semyon 14:35, May 28, 2011 (UTC) ::::::Indeed... same goes for the Second World War; it was inevitable, with the humilation of Germany in the First World War and the urge for a strong leader, who would take back what was theirs and heal the national trauma of WWI. This man came, in the form of Hitler, but it could just as easily have been another person. The same way the First World War could not have been prevented, neither could the second. Nationalism is not the only reason to blame. I myself am a nationalist and I am not constantly yelling we should wage war on everyone, am I? In fact, I'm not saying we should wage war on anyone, unless attacked or provocated, but then again, that speaks for itself. Nationalism in itself is a good thing; any sensible and wise person ought to have a healthy sense of national and cultural pride. Nationalism is not neccesarily a bad thing. It did many nations much good, in fact. The Master's Voice 14:39, May 28, 2011 (UTC) ::I think this convo got away, from what i wanted to happen, beacuse of Master taking it to heart for some reason. What i meant was really that Lovia is this booming country will only 20,000 people of 10,000 businesses. Just saying that since we want to be a real country let's make it more realistic, with another small group of nationalists. Maybe create three more hamlets make the population equations bigger to make Lovia have 50,000 - 60,000 people. Marcus/Michael Villanova 14:15, May 29, 2011 (UTC) :::Nationalism is not something merely linked to poorer societies where the people hope for better times. A country that is succesful and thriving presents it's inhabitants with all the more reason to be proud of it's nations or region's accomplishment. Take the US, for example: a country that is, in general, quite wealthy. And at the same time extremely patriotic. I find that both understandable and respectable, aswell as realistic. The Master's Voice 14:45, May 29, 2011 (UTC) ::::Besides that: if one region is infact (relatively) poor(er) compared to other regions, that gives it's inhabitants all the more reason to be nationalistic as they might feel injustice has been done on their part. The Master's Voice 14:46, May 29, 2011 (UTC) :::::@TMV: the US patriotism is a vehicle to unite the country and avoid decentralization. Most people's mistake is to think of nationalism as an actual view while it is in fact an 'outer layer' that can be applied on any ideological premise. It is natural to seek a feeling of unity though. :::::@Marcus: do you suggest like King's nationalists or Seven federalists? 14:51, May 29, 2011 (UTC) ::@TMV- Yeah I don't really see what your getting at Lovia isn't a poor country but rich, i'd say the richest in the world, or in the top five. @Yuri - No more like other reglar nationalists. Marcus/Michael Villanova 16:50, May 29, 2011 (UTC)